Author Topic: New WRX...electric turbo?  (Read 373 times)

Offline kevinmfb

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Re: New WRX...electric turbo?
« Reply #1 on: February 06, 2012, 03:07:59 PM »
That's the photoshop pic that's been floating around for a few years now, would be so cool if they went that direction. 

And what they say of an electric turbo is really compelling, sounds like a bit of an engineering headache, though.
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Offline josh ulozas

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Re: New WRX...electric turbo?
« Reply #2 on: February 06, 2012, 04:15:21 PM »
yeah i really wish they would make a Subaru with the roof scoop that comes stock!!! it would be soo cool.
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Offline Sundawg

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Re: New WRX...electric turbo?
« Reply #3 on: February 06, 2012, 06:17:36 PM »
I'm more intrigued by the fact that the article mentions a new sport wagon for 2014.  With the WRX getting smaller and the last 2 Imprezas being more hatch-like.  I would like to see a new turbo wagon that's a little bigger than the current hatch, but smaller than the Legacy and Outback.

Or maybe they're just a year off and talking about the XV/Crosstrek :(
« Last Edit: February 06, 2012, 11:10:28 PM by Sundawg »
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Offline ZETA

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Re: New WRX...electric turbo?
« Reply #4 on: February 06, 2012, 06:53:40 PM »
That's a scary concept, I don't know why =/  I think the low section of the grille needs to come up or something.
Anyone know where I might find some Ugg boots?
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Offline Bounty Hunter

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Re: New WRX...electric turbo?
« Reply #5 on: February 06, 2012, 07:14:11 PM »
Hmm...interesting.  I'm not so sure about the electric turbo.  I think it'll be nice to see Subaru build another 2 dr AWD performance coupe (don't even bring up the BRZ...it's not AWD).   :P 

Let's keep this thread updated.   8)
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Offline TeknoCop

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Re: New WRX...electric turbo?
« Reply #6 on: February 06, 2012, 07:35:02 PM »
Hmm...interesting.  I'm not so sure about the electric turbo.  I think it'll be nice to see Subaru build another 2 dr AWD performance coupe (don't even bring up the BRZ...it's not AWD).   :P 

Let's keep this thread updated.   8)

Might be cool...I dont have much faith in Subaru to produce anything better then the current WRX/STi.  They are too worried about EPA and MPG.  A 1.6L in a WRX...that sounds like fun.  :-\   300hp is not just not enough for the market that the STi's are in.  There are too many cars that are nicer and more powerful then the STi's now a days.  Geesh, Im starting to get a little bitter.   :subaru:

Offline RedOxRu

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Re: New WRX...electric turbo?
« Reply #7 on: February 06, 2012, 08:00:47 PM »
Electric turbos would be interesting in terms of a hybrid setup. Braking regenerates to high power capacitors or batteries and you use that power for instant boost.

Would be cool. Might be a pipe dream at this point. I'm thinking we'd see this kind of stuff hit home in really expensive stuff first.


As far as crazy/out there stuff goes, BMW just did a 3 turbo sequential diesel. That'd be nuts...

Offline arau

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Re: New WRX...electric turbo?
« Reply #8 on: February 06, 2012, 09:03:04 PM »
I guess i grew up with hot rods and muscle cars that me and my dad built and stuff and you never worried bout the "pollution" that comes out of the exhaust, same goes with what we do Subaru's and any thing performance varied. I guess where im coming from is... LEAVE HYBRID **** OUT OF PERFORMANCE CARS! I mean really? a STI Hybrid? if you really want MPGS and not hurt the environment , get a Prius..  i mean its so stupid. Maybe its just me and i could care less about the environment because its already Ruined and stuff and you cant change that lol.  but ive heard of 500 hp+ sti's and such that get 35+ Mpg. but it has power to back it up. Like  Chevy is putting a I-4 138 hp turbocharged motor in there Sonic and Cruz. and says it gets 26mpg. Thats what im getting in my 4 door wrx that has closer to 300 hp...  i dont know if its just these auto makers these days or what but in my opinion they are not trying hard enough to produce cars that are more gas friendly.

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Offline fishrguy29

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Re: New WRX...electric turbo?
« Reply #9 on: February 06, 2012, 09:46:33 PM »
i agree with Arau on the hybrid performance. most people going for performance aren't going for MPG or eco friendly. i hate the new NSX with half gas half electric and Mitsubishi is looking at doing that to the new EVO. come on its stupid to do that and its gonna hurt them in the end because mechanics aren't gonna wanna work on that **** and no ones gonna wanna pay for it either. repair work is gonna total the car easily if anything really happens to it. IMO. If everything goes hybrid or electric i'm sticking with older years and done looking at new ones.

I'm all for hybrids and MPGs and eco friendly but not when i'm looking for performance out of a car. the only plus i see to more hybrids and electric is the decrease in oil demand meaning a surplus of it causing a decrease in price.  :thumbsup:

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Re: New WRX...electric turbo?
« Reply #10 on: February 06, 2012, 10:49:17 PM »
Any performance mod will net more mpg if you can keep your foot out of it, straight up.  Works even better if you swap in to a lighter car or lighten whatever car you have to begin with.  The greater power can move around the smaller mass, easier.

As a counterpoint to the philosophical discussion that has ensued, check out the diesel Audi R10 prototype racer.  It's a multiple time winner, in part due to it's greater efficiency; has to pit less often = fastar as a race car.  They're debuting a hybrid version this year at 24-hr Les Mans, and Peugeot was developing a hybrid of their own until they pulled out of the season entirely. 

I agree that hybrids are silly and pretty much a marketing gimmick in large part (why not just better engineer existing full gas or diesel engines, the r&d certainly can't be cheap for hybrid stuff, so there's money for it..?).  But for the sake of discussion, there are places where hybrid makes sense and can do more than a pure combustion engine can, alone.
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Offline ZETA

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Re: New WRX...electric turbo?
« Reply #11 on: February 07, 2012, 08:42:10 AM »
On the Cruze subject, are you talking about city or highway?  The Chevrolet Cruze Eco has a 1.4L Turbocharged motor rated at 28/42mpg.  The Cruze non-Eco with the turbo 1.4L still gets 26/38mpg, and the 1.8L non-turbo gets 25/36mpg.

The reason Subaru wants to keep emissions down is kind of the basis for the company.  If you go to corporate, it's all a bunch of tree hugging environmentalists pretty much lol.  We have cars built in zero-landfill status production plants, meaning that not a single bit of waste is sent to a landfill at our plants.  It's either some way recycled back into production for the next car in the line, sent to a recycling facility, or incinerated to produce electricity.  The plant here in the USA is also a wildlife habitat.  Last trash day, you took out more trash than Subaru did in the past 8 years  ;)  So knowing who is building our cars and what they do, it's not surprising that they're trying to squeeze in some hybrid technology.
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Offline arau

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Re: New WRX...electric turbo?
« Reply #12 on: February 07, 2012, 09:32:11 AM »
On the Cruze subject, are you talking about city or highway?  The Chevrolet Cruze Eco has a 1.4L Turbocharged motor rated at 28/42mpg.  The Cruze non-Eco with the turbo 1.4L still gets 26/38mpg, and the 1.8L non-turbo gets 25/36mpg.

The reason Subaru wants to keep emissions down is kind of the basis for the company.  If you go to corporate, it's all a bunch of tree hugging environmentalists pretty much lol.  We have cars built in zero-landfill status production plants, meaning that not a single bit of waste is sent to a landfill at our plants.  It's either some way recycled back into production for the next car in the line, sent to a recycling facility, or incinerated to produce electricity.  The plant here in the USA is also a wildlife habitat.  Last trash day, you took out more trash than Subaru did in the past 8 years  ;)  So knowing who is building our cars and what they do, it's not surprising that they're trying to squeeze in some hybrid technology.

In the Chevy Brochure i got from the Auto show, it says 1.4L turbo, 26/28. unless its a mis-print. But im glad that Subaru Plants are Zero Landfill Plants. I love that, because there one of the only few to do that. That is why i love Subaru because the stuff they do is rare... or not common. And just like the New BRZ coming out, its RWD... that car will hurt there sales so much because most people cant afford a Dailly 4x4 or awd etc. and a "play" car that is RWD. Most of the people on here that bought there Subaru's are because its AWD since we live in the Midwest where it snows, RWD will get you no where. and They bought it because you can make it more powerful or track it or Rally cross it.  Then goes for the Hybrid part, Subaru is starting to follow the Bandwagon that everyone else is following. When Subaru could Start putting more of there diesels into there cars there Mpg's would raise and there Emissions would drop (with the right EM). I know of a F350 Super Duty power stroke that gets 32mpg on the interstate towing! that is insane, let alone the truck it self weighs 9000 pounds plus your load, and its emissions are less then a small car. all that im saying is they could put more effort in there developmental. Just like when Subaru Stopped making Sti's sedans.. The last year for the sedan's were 07 and they waited till 2011 to bring it back. They brought it back because there sales dropped a lot on the STI. I have a feeling its going to be the same way on a hybrid set up. let alone direct injection turbo motor. You know how hard that is going to be to work or tune on. The aftermarket parts and Development sales are either not going to make parts for that or make them and be so expensive.

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Offline bspec

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Re: New WRX...electric turbo?
« Reply #13 on: February 07, 2012, 11:02:18 AM »
Why all the hate on electrics? Instant peak torque? Yes please! I am an enthusiast, and I'm all for pushing the performance envelope. The more new ideas and new tech, the better. If it adds some efficiency, that's even better.

The hate on electrics (hybrids, etc.) sounds like the hate on EFI back in the day. Old timers afraid of new tech. Turns out EFI was better and this new tech will be better too. I'm very excited for the future of performance cars.
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Offline omahasubaru

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Re: New WRX...electric turbo?
« Reply #14 on: February 07, 2012, 11:19:09 AM »
Why all the hate on electrics? Instant peak torque? Yes please! I am an enthusiast, and I'm all for pushing the performance envelope. The more new ideas and new tech, the better. If it adds some efficiency, that's even better.

^^ This!

If subaru can pull it off, it will be freakin' amazing!
god wants you to - in all cases - run as much boost as you possibly can.. why else would he have created the turbocharger? - 2JZfan

Offline kevinmfb

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Re: New WRX...electric turbo?
« Reply #15 on: February 07, 2012, 12:47:38 PM »
A lot of the emissions strictness is coming from the EPA.
Car manufacturers have to operate within certain government guidelines to have a car deemed road-worthy.  Once it leaves the plant and has passed emissions us as consumers, especially here in Nebraska, can do whatever we want to the car.  I say especially here in Nebraska due to no public emissions testing (yet).


I am down for new technology.  Especially the point they make with electric turbos having no turbo lag at all.  Dead on boost whenever you need it sounds pretty friggin' cool to me.  Just think if you could have a serparate in car boost control for your turbo; you could be spooling to the proper boost precisely when needed with less wear-n-tear on the motor, trans, wallet...


Push your 13-20 psi button, launch the car then let the computer taper for you.
Highway driving; set your boost low for cruising and those darn MPGs everybody is talking about.
It'd be like having the ability to run different maps with the push of a button on the fly.
Maybe I'm dreamer...



« Last Edit: February 07, 2012, 12:50:05 PM by kevinmfb »

Offline ZETA

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Re: New WRX...electric turbo?
« Reply #16 on: February 07, 2012, 01:12:37 PM »
Kevin! Finally we see a use for SI-Drive! :D
Anyone know where I might find some Ugg boots?
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Offline omahasubaru

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Re: New WRX...electric turbo?
« Reply #17 on: February 07, 2012, 01:23:55 PM »
You can already have different maps stored to the stock switch. *shrug*
god wants you to - in all cases - run as much boost as you possibly can.. why else would he have created the turbocharger? - 2JZfan

Offline kevinmfb

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Re: New WRX...electric turbo?
« Reply #18 on: February 07, 2012, 01:40:44 PM »
On the fly? And with the utmost of efficiency?
My thinking is like these Eco motors that cut cylinders at highway speeds but without actually cutting cylinders as it's a 4.


Does anybody else have any thought on how an electric turbo could be uniquely beneficial to performance applications and economy in one application?
Maybe I'm not putting the words on the screen that I'm thinking...nor am I a Subaru engineer like many on these forums seem to be.


compressor speed and power are independent from turbine speed and power. This design flexibility leads to further improvements in turbine and compressor efficiency, beyond a conventional turbocharger
« Last Edit: February 07, 2012, 01:48:33 PM by kevinmfb »

Offline ZETA

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Re: New WRX...electric turbo?
« Reply #19 on: February 07, 2012, 01:59:11 PM »
Looks like the turbine is entirely used for generating electricity, and the compressor part of what usually would be on the same shaft of the turbine is now just a really high powered computer fan.  At least that's what I'm getting out of this.  In my thought patterns, this means insta-boost at variable voltage based speeds, no matter what the RPM when all you have to do is run an electric fan.

Many, many, MANY advantages to this if properly fitted and designed.
« Last Edit: February 07, 2012, 02:51:55 PM by ZETA »
Anyone know where I might find some Ugg boots?
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Offline kevinmfb

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Re: New WRX...electric turbo?
« Reply #20 on: February 07, 2012, 02:00:39 PM »
As my interest grows in the possibility of the smaller displacement WRX I have done some quick reading.


Very cool possibilities not only in gasoline burning engines but hybrid motors as well.


http://www.turbodyne.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=17&Itemid=12


The TurboFlow™ system can run independently of the engine and it can be used throughout a driving cycle  < This is what I was meaning by putting a "dial" on the electric turbo since it's not relying on exhaust gasses to spin the turbine.

Offline omahasubaru

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Re: New WRX...electric turbo?
« Reply #21 on: February 07, 2012, 02:02:13 PM »
On the fly? And with the utmost of efficiency?

Yes.

I think speculation on what subaru may do is pointless. Lets see what they come up with and then we can start to hypothesize how to make it even better.
god wants you to - in all cases - run as much boost as you possibly can.. why else would he have created the turbocharger? - 2JZfan

Offline kevinmfb

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Re: New WRX...electric turbo?
« Reply #22 on: February 07, 2012, 02:17:24 PM »
See everybody in 2014  :-\

Offline ZETA

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Re: New WRX...electric turbo?
« Reply #23 on: February 07, 2012, 02:52:17 PM »
I modified an existing turbocharger diagram to show what it is that I was thinking of.  THIS MAY OR MAY NOT BE RELATED IN ANY WAY TO WHAT SUBARU HAS IN MIND, this is just what I was thinking of.

Also, instead of direct wiring to the fan, it would make more sense to have the wires from the generator go to a capacitor and a computer controlled voltage regulator.
Anyone know where I might find some Ugg boots?
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Offline bspec

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Re: New WRX...electric turbo?
« Reply #24 on: February 07, 2012, 04:25:11 PM »
Electric turbos could in theory reduce or eliminate the need for the water and oil lines on turbos vastly reducing plumbing complexity. Very cool stuff. Also, with the separation of the turbine and compressor, you would have many more mounting options and would eliminate the comments about how the BRZ can't be turbo-charged because there is no room.
Does your car understeer like a drunken Subaru?

I don't always tune subaru's...but when I do, they sprout wings and fly.